Discussion

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It's like Discussion, y'all. Anything that you might want to draw attention to can be posted and commented upon here. For now, a central location for discussions is more viable than commenting in talk pages, where it may be easily overlooked.

Contents

Navbox

I was trying to add Navboxes to the bottom of pages (as seen here) but it looks like some CSS needs to be added to MediaWiki:Common.css (from here) and potentially Javascript to MediaWiki:Common.js (from here). I would add them myself but the pages are protected, so if it's alright, could the styles/scripts please be added? A Mysterious Voice (talk) 09:35, 24 September 2012 (CEST)

Proposed Image Standards

I'm going to propose some standards.

  • Preferred image type is .png. All image names should be one word, regardless of spaces in the name of the actual item. First letter is capitalized, the rest lowercase. Example: Wooden Wand => Woodenwand.png
  • Item images should be 52x52, 53x53 or some combination thereof, depending on the item. It seems to vary.
  • The corners of items should be white, not brown, as this is the way the individual sprites appear.

More to come. Feel free to discuss.--Nightvol (talk) 17:50, 18 July 2012 (CEST)

Apologies, I started uploading images before seeing this page, so my file names did not follow the standard you proposed. I'm not sure if they can be renamed.

For size, I think all items should be 52x52. When an item is equipped or found, it's displayed at that size with no anti-aliasing. In the inventory there's half a pixel shift because of how flash works, which causes anti-aliasing, so those shouldn't be used. I also made my images have transparent corners with a quick PhotoShop macro, so they should look proper on any background. Plus4 (talk) 20:35, 2 August 2012 (CEST)

I haven't noticed any anti-aliasing problems with inventory screenshots. Also I usually crop to 54x54 or 55x54 w/ transparent corners & it hasn't "broken" anything that I've seen. --SnarFoo (talk) 20:24, 26 May 2013 (UTC)

Suggestions

Just a couple of suggestions.

-- Have the page layout be the same as the KoL wiki. As in, Personal Tools being on the left side bar, and also "Page" and "Discussion" be moved to the right with "read", "edit", etc..

-- Install the wiki ImageMap extension.. might be semi-useful.. not necessary though :)

Thanks --Khamul (talk) 00:58, 17 July 2012 (CEST)


Semantic MediaWiki

Is there a chance we could get the Semantic MediaWiki extension installed on here? I'm kind of new to this Wiki editing thing, but it looks like it'd help out a lot with using data in multiple places (eg: skill info on the skill page, in the skills list, on a monster page, etc). A Mysterious Voice (talk) 09:56, 18 July 2012 (CEST)

  • Edited to make sense now that it's more public. I also took the liberty of testing out what I said, and it works pretty much as I'd expected. A Mysterious Voice (talk) 17:27, 18 July 2012 (CEST)
  • So I have most of the monster info transcribed, but before I start posting it, I'd rather get a yea or nay on whether we can have Semantic installed. At the moment, if we want to have item and skill info on other pages (like the Skills and Items pages, monster pages, etc), we have to copy the long-ish template tag for each one into the page, which gets cluttered really fast. With Semantic, you can have it setup in such a way that you just have to provide the name on the page (eg: {{SkillRow|name=Gaffle}} ) and the template handles the rest. It's not like it's impossible to do it without the extension, but it would make everything a lot cleaner and sexier. A Mysterious Voice (talk) 13:50, 19 July 2012 (CEST)

Info Gathering

So, while I haven't made any real pages yet, I've been compiling lots of info as I go through on a new Warrior. I've got stats (HP, MP, Atk, Def & Vocab) of all the enemies in the zones so far (up through The Forest as I write this), in addition to as much of their abilities as I can figure (MP cost, effects, duration), the drops I've found from them (not counting "special event" drops that seem to be zone-based), and their Milestones. I also have mini-screenshots (.png files made with Win7's Snipping Tool) of icons & "status blocks" of all the items I've found so far. I'm not certain if someone would like this to, well, parse into the Wiki I guess, but I'd be happy to email or upload this stuff somewhere if someone wants to utilize it.

I'll be going through the other zones as well as I get to them.--Mstieler (talk) 11:16, 19 July 2012 (CEST)

On a sightly different note, I've collected a bunch of data on the Tech Dream skills and have got working formulas for the damage. What do people think the best way to add that info to the skill's page would be? --Tz BG (talk) 20:21, 21 July 2012 (CEST)

Honestly, whichever way seems best to you. And anyway, if you post it and it needs formatting or something, I'm sure someone will come along and play markup hackysack with it for a while. --A Mysterious Voice (talk) 21:55, 21 July 2012 (CEST)

Template Templates

So, I just added a prototype inline Milestone template, and it strikes me that all three of the inline templates so far look pretty much the same. Personally, I like the style, but I'm sure it will send at least one person viewing the page into fits of unbridled rage. Is the similarity a good thing? Is it a bad thing? Why, or why not? If so, how should it be altered? Will Mandy ever find true love? Discussify! --A Mysterious Voice (talk) 21:55, 21 July 2012 (CEST)

Template Colours

New to the wiki here, but looking to add some drop data. I'm kind of confused about the colour bars on the left side of the tables. Looking at the Bandit Cutpurse page for example, the Milestones section is coloured red/blue according to class, but then the Item Drops are coloured red/blue/grey according to item type (I think?). I'd propose that the red/blue distinction is kept for class differences only. For example, as a wizard, I get the robber's ring, but as warrior, I get Leather Gloves, and get Gold and brandy as both. Any objections to changing that? EDIT: Just realized that no one has contributed to this in over a month. I'm just going to assume it's okay and make some changes. Feel free to revert if any objections.

Also - what's the second=true tag for? It seems to slightly change the background colour of the item, but what is its intended use?

Thanks! Aelfinn (talk) 17:56, 17 November 2012 (CET)

Rarity Colours

The other place where colours are used is for rarity. It is currently, however, a mixture of several properties that makes some cases very unclear. I propose we divide it up and indicate the properties as so:

Rarity (use the colours as we do now):
  • Common: 50%-100% probability
  • Uncommon: 10%-49% probability
  • Rare: 1-9% probability
  • Crafted: 1-100% probability (actual probability depends on ingredients)
Source (use a non-intrusive, mainly transparent texture overlaid on the background rarity colour)
  • Normal drop (no texture); combines with all rarities
  • Ring (a ring texture); combines with Common, Uncommon, or Rare
  • Fight Club (a fist texture); combines with Common
Uniqueness (indicated separately, perhaps with a superscript 1 or star, or a separate row/column in the description)
  • Not unique; combines with all sources
  • Unique; combines with Normal and Fight Club

Does that make sense? --Fig bucket (talk) 13:52, 23 June 2013 (UTC) I think I've been talking in Talk: sections by accident rather than here. Please see Talk:Item_Drop_Mechanics --Loki (talk) 12:46, 5 November 2013 (UTC)

Redundancy in Data

Item data is passed in 3 separate templates, {{Item}}, {{ItemRow}}, and {{ItemRowDetailed}}, but these are really just ways of formatting (subsets of the) same information differently---the ItemRow* templates for table rows, and the Item template is really an item infobox. This results in inconsistencies as the same info is repeated but not necessarily kept in synch, and multiplies the number of edits needed when updating template parameters as well. (And a similar concern exists for monsters, skills, effects.)

I'd like to make that much less redundant, by doing something similar to what the KoL wiki does, in using a special Data namespace for centralizing raw item/monster/etc data which can then be queried as needed. We can't actually make a separate namespace for Data pages without modifying the mediawiki source (and the admins/owners are not exactly attentive/responsive here, so that's unlikely), but we can still do more or less the same thing with just slightly different syntax. So, this is what it would be like:

  • A trivial {{Select}} template is created, which just returns the value of the named-parameter specified by its first unnamed argument.
  • Every item (eg "Delicious Truffle") has a data page (eg "Data:Delicious Truffle"). That page is actually just an invocation of the Select template, passing in named parameters for all data values, along with its first argument as an unnamed parameter. So it looks pretty much just like a key-value pairing.
  • That data page can then be used as a template, passing in the name of the attribute you want to get the corresponding value. E.g., "{{:Data:Delicious Truffle|type}}" would return "Potion".

Objections? Better solutions? Comments? I'll also take dead silence as affirmation... --Fig bucket (talk) 20:09, 29 May 2013 (UTC)

Sounds like a good thing to do. I don't have that much further input, except to say it's good if you can make easy to understand documentation for it. Then I might even be adding some data. :) --Notsupposedtobehere (talk) 20:22, 29 May 2013 (UTC)
  • Yes, good instruction/help is important. Here, I've made a mock-up of what I mean. You can see the Data:Delicious Truffle page as an example, and try it out: {{:Data:Delicious Truffle|type}}=Potion, {{:Data:Delicious Truffle|name}}=Delicious Truffle, {{:Data:Delicious Truffle|class}}=Both, etc. I added some description to the Help:Contents page, which is also a link conveniently given when you attempt to create a new page. --Fig bucket (talk) 21:24, 29 May 2013 (UTC)

Cheating/Hacking

Is it a welcome idea to post info on how to cheat via saved game hacking, for those who enjoy such things? --Loki (talk) 23:33, 14 September 2013 (UTC)

  • Sure, I don't see why not. --Fig bucket (talk) 23:55, 14 September 2013 (UTC)
  • Added a link under Strategy on the main page. Sorry for deletion, I'm somewhat new to wikis in general, didn't realize the protocol. --Loki (talk) 10:44, 17 September 2013 (UTC)
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